Who knows what?

[cookchh]

Luke,
Just a simple question:
Who can read an alliance page outside of alliance members and you?
Same question for PM's.

[RagingMongoose]

As an ex-staff member I can tell you that only admins (reds) can see either, however it is staff policy that they can only review alliance boards if there is a complaint (would normally have to be from a member of said alliance). PMs are a different matter and can only be seen with Luke's direct permission and authorisation, and in order to gain that then generally extreme circumstances (e.g. Severe harassment, racism, illegal activities) would be required. All admin activity is logged. Mods (greens) have no access to do either and can only moderate forum areas, not in-game areas.

Luke can confirm or correct if I'm wrong, but just wanted to give you an answer in case you were concerned as a matter of urgency Cook.

[cookchh]

No urgency, just trying to determine who can see what. Reds and greens?

[RagingMongoose]

No urgency, just trying to determine who can see what. Reds and greens?

The colours of usernames, complete list here:

http://www.gewar.net/forum/showgroups.php

Admins/Reds are the only ones with any visibility of in-game pages such as alliance pages in your example. Mods/greens only have additional visibility of forum areas and their access is ring fenced to that and doesn't allow for any extra in-game visibility to that of a normal player like you or I.

[cookchh]

The colours of usernames, complete list here:

http://www.gewar.net/forum/showgroups.php

Admins/Reds are the only ones with any visibility of in-game pages such as alliance pages in your example. Mods/greens only have additional visibility of forum areas and their access is ring fenced to that and doesn't allow for any extra in-game visibility to that of a normal player like you or I.

So some of the admins are players? How do you rectify the conflict of interest?

[yome]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like this sheet hasn't been updated in a while. A lot (or most) of it is incorrect.

[Luke]

Quick response before I run off to work:

PM's: only I could see them, but that is illegal. It's private.
Alliance messages: Only I have access to that database. Nobody else. That is indeed only checked upon if someone comes forward that there is a problem(like we had in the past with alliance members discussing hacking).

[keo]

So be calm down,
be quiet
be smart

[SJ]

So some of the admins are players? How do you rectify the conflict of interest?

What conflict of interest? The playing accounts are entirely seperate from your admin acct. You do not have any access with them, you have exactly the same as any other player. Prophet played as a player and won the round, ask him if he had a conflict of interest Cook?

I can tell you my own playing acct, has actually helped your alliance, I have left a non donator alone, given him back his city despite him attacking me and have asked for my alliance to do the same. If that is a conflict of interest then I have no clue what isnt. I have purposefully stayed out of the alliance politics between mine and your own alliance so that there could be no confusion or accusations.

Edit* What Luke failed to also say was that a fair few months back there was a glitch in the system and a player was able to gain access to the staff forums, with that happening all admin access was shut down and all passwords changed. So we are not able to read alliance pages, only Luke can, and only when he has something reported to him does he go and check it is correct.

[Chris16]

By conflict of interest i assumed he is talking about current geo counts of the entire alliance aswell as tactics or possible upcoming attacks by an alliance. I'm guessing that all could be gotten by an admin?

[SJ]

By conflict of interest i assumed he is talking about current geo counts of the entire alliance aswell as tactics or possible upcoming attacks by an alliance. I'm guessing that all could be gotten by an admin?

Nope, as I said before Chris we do not have that access any longer as the passwords etc were changed.

Sorry I should add I had edited my post earlier so you may have missed me saying that.

[Chris16]

Is Luke able to give any admin access if for some reason he cant, busy at work or something

[SJ]

Yes, but he will not have done that Chris, he took the access down when a glitch in the system allowed a player onto the staff forums, luckily the player was very honest and told us immediately. But Luke then changed all the passwords and login details, so we have not had that access since. I cannot remember how long ago it was off the top of my head, but I think possibly 5-6 months ago.

Now the admins do have more access than the greenies, we have an admin page called the admincp, but as for personal information like banks, alliance pages, resource planting no way.

We have never been able to see pms on this version, only those with actual database access could do that, ie Luke and when Prophet was a coder Prophet.

Edit* Chris I just wanted to expand on this a little, Luke has every right to check these pages, this is after all his game. Also he had in the past some threatening to hack the game and had he not had that reported to him he would never have known.

[Chris16]

OK thanks for the info :)
And yes i completely agree that luke should have total access, as you said it is his game.

[thomas85]

Okay I echo this just to make sure it's noticed:


PM's: only I could see them, but that is illegal. It's private.


Private Messages are private and absolutely safe, not even Luke would read any of them, it would be an illegal act in the same way as opening someone else's mail or e-mail messages.
(And btw, that's the reason why publishing private messages anywhere without sender's and all recipients' permission is also not allowed)

[R2D2]

Why are you asking this Cook and Chris..?
Is has quite frankly nothing to do with you? And if you are the reason admins can't play YET AGAIN.. then I will make sure I adapt my plans for this round.

[Starbuck]

Luke just said admins can't view alliance details so why the fuss? They have playing accounts like everyone else and can't see details of alliances...

[Capt_ItchyBeard]

I can read everything also have web cams running on a couple players computers.;lame


You know why cause im Batman

http://www.gewar.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=178&pictureid=1528


Can I ask do you think that information is being taken from your alliance page and pm's ?

I would be shocked if it were.

[thomas85]

Can I ask do you think that information is being taken from your alliance page and pm's ?

I would be shocked if it were.

That would only happen to you if you played on gewar1984.net :D

[Peonboss]

Since I know all the answers to the questions asked here why would they be talking for me. I wasn't around to ask so they asked themselves. Please do not bring me into conversations.
Furthermore I have also not called people names as by the new rules... Have you read them? And I am neither silly nor a young male. Thank you.

[RagingMongoose]

PM's: only I could see them, but that is illegal. It's private.

Actually it's only illegal at present due to the lack of a messaging policy. If such a policy were in place warning players that private messages could be reviewed, by whom, and under what circumstances then those denoted in that policy could access PMs under certain conditions. In turn, the game terms and conditions that players agree to would have to include the fact that by agreeing, players also agree to the messaging policy. There are several legal precedents for this across the world, including Europe, and it's common place in almost all businesses for employees to have such a policy as part of their contractual terms and conditions.

Of course, law enforcement and national security agencies could also force you to provide access to PMs of players if they suspected criminal activity.

[Peonboss]

I could take that further and say it would depend on where the servers are located. With out a privacy policy in place legally in the states there is no implied privacy for a game like this. It is at the owners discretion.

[cookchh]

If you look at my origional posts, all I did was ask a question. I did not accuse anyone or even hint at accusing anyone of anything. There has been a lot of chatter and I wanted to get the facts from the horses mouth. Let's cool down guys.

[Peonboss]

Omg the rumor mill in here.

Ok simply. We had a member of the alliance say something innocently on the alliance page, but it was taken badly and he was called on it by staff. He then left the alliance because he does not want the scrutiny we seem to be under.

Understand? I was not involved. I was not around. All the questions and queries about who is playing and not have not been asked of me nor have I given answers. In short my only involvement has been to tell people to relax. Questions all answered?

[SJ]

Peons last post is absolutely correct and this was nothing to do with him. I am not sure why he got dragged into it, but he needs to be left alone.

[RagingMongoose]

I could take that further and say it would depend on where the servers are located. With out a privacy policy in place legally in the states there is no implied privacy for a game like this. It is at the owners discretion.

Yeah I'm not sure on the specifics in the States but I know your government isn't too keen on privacy unless it's their own haha - oh god, don't let Melek see this! European law is tougher on privacy and data protection, with those areas applying to all EU member countries. However, as is always the case, where there's a will there's a way and messaging in particular is a well tested area legally.

[SJ]

Sj I believe he said sj but meant starbuck. Didn't we adapt the rules to stop threads being diverted just like this.

Yes we did I am currently on my mobile, but as soon as on laptop will edit, sorry I would have done it sooner but have not had any access. Unless another member of staff is available to edit please.

Ty for clearing that up PB I did not understand Cooks comment at all lol

[Chris16]

Can I ask R2D2 what exactly has nothing to do with cook or I? I believe we as players have every right to ask about anything about this. So maybe get off that high horse of yours and go take a long walk off a short pier.
Acting like your the pottymouth on the internet, good for you.
then I will make sure I adapt my plans for this round.
Since you can acted like a 'badass' on here why not I.
Why is the Admins playing or not any of your business? If its your fault there playing again... the I will make sure I adapt my plans for this round ;)

[cookchh]

Sorry sj meant starbuck. Misread you message. Ill rescind.

[kaltho]

@#%^*()&%$^ @@^*^*_(&&% $%^%^^_!

[cookchh]

Guys calm down. Let luke reply, just want to get the facts straight.

[R2D2]

Hahahaha look at little Chris giving it big time!
Why didn't you ask on the help desk or pm one of the admins directly rather then bring it to the forum?Everyone can see that deep down, you both are questioning whether admins can or are cheating?
Oh, are you implying I should go kill myself? What a wanderful thing to say dude.. where did you learn that one, on the school playing field?

Them playing or not is my business as one of the admins is a good friend who is in my alliance... And I'm saying if its because you being a little turd that they can't play anymore then I'll make slight adjustments to what I have planned :)

[cookchh]

I created a forum post to put the answer into light for ALL, so that second hand knowledge did not have to continue to be passed. Can I delete others posts on my thread? R2 you are flaming, stop pushing people.

[Chris16]

Not going to defile this thread, not mine so not my place.
Not trying to argue with you, i increased on the point already mentioned on the thread and the question i put forward was answered.
I'm not implying anything nor have i any problem with admins playing.
I feel like its within everybodys right here to ask about stuff like this.

[SJ]

Please can we all just calm down a little. Firstly the questions asked were not secrets, any player could have asked them and would have been quite within their rights to know the answers. Secondly I think the questions have now been answered so there is no need for anyone to feel frustrated or angry. So please can we all just calm down a little.

[RagingMongoose]

So please can we all just calm down a little.

I politely decline your request. Ahhhhh Peon. Ahhhhh that little robot boy R2. Ahhhhh people asking questions. Ahhhhh Starbuck. Ahhhhh admins on phones. Ahhhh I bet it's an iPhone. Ahhhh, why's it Cookchh, not Chefchh?!

Let's go mental and tear this place a new one haha.

[cookchh]

Is it possible to change my screen name?
I think peonboss2 has a nice ring to it lol.
But seriously is there a way to...or is that just admins?

[Chris16]

Should i feel bad that you didnt mention me RM :'(

[Peonboss]

Please god, there is not enough space in the world to have 2 peonboss sized egos.

[thomas85]

Is it possible to change my screen name?
I think peonboss2 has a nice ring to it lol.
But seriously is there a way to...or is that just admins?

If you a serious with wishing a new screen name, post your request on the help center. :)

[cookchh]

Should i feel bad that you didnt mention me RM :'(

Rm has shunned you lol.

[Starbuck]

Well now that the issue is resolved I hope the admins that's still playing will continue doing so, no need to stop playing because we all know, and knew before this, only Luke can see alliance pages...

[Peonboss]

...because we all know, and knew before this, only Luke can see alliance pages...

Actually I am sorry to correct you, but that would be incorrect.

As an ex-staff member I can tell you that only admins (reds) can see either, however it is staff policy that they can only review alliance boards if there is a complaint

Yes, but ... we have not had that access since. I cannot remember how long ago it was off the top of my head, but I think possibly 5-6 months ago.


Since neither I not Ragin knew of the change I would say not everyone did know this and some good has came out of this thread. Good questions and good answers.

I have not made up my mind on if admins should play, and as the only staff member forced to stop playing because players said I had an "advantage" I am not sure how others can be so sure of their convictions. But time will tell if it is a good thing for the game that they are involved or bad. Right now I do not believe we have enough data to come to a conclusion.

[Starbuck]

as the only staff member forced to stop playing because players said I had an "advantage" I am not sure how others can be so sure of their convictions.

OMG this was on the alpha game 600 years ago...

And the admins did stop playing a while ago but then they all decided it's best to have them playing to better understand the game. That's when prophet, Luke, Huxy, Bob and SJ started to play and now there's only 2 left playing and I wonder why that is!

[ghetto bob]

I have not made up my mind on if admins should play, and as the only staff member forced to stop playing because players said I had an "advantage" I am not sure how others can be so sure of their convictions.

When asked to join GEPolice, I (nor anyone else involved) was allowed to have a player account due to the amount of in-game access we had to track and find cheats. That is the level of access that you enjoyed on the Alpha server, that is the reason that you were asked to stop playing.

That only recently changed when it came to light on these very forums that the people who worked here weren't allowed to play. Overwhelmingly, the community came forward and supported the notion of trusting the people that worked here to also play here.

Let me put out there that I (and I'm quite certain that I speak for any and all playing staff) have far better things to do with my life than cheat on an online game. Especially one that I have been involved with for more than 6 and a half years. I resent that you question my "convictions".

[Peonboss]

OMG this was on the alpha game 600 years ago...

And the admins did stop playing a while ago but then they all decided it's best to have them playing to better understand the game. That's when prophet, Luke, Huxy, Bob and SJ started to play and now there's only 2 left playing and I wonder why that is!

Well right now we only have 2 playing...
25 ClarenceBeeks
31 Moonshine

But both Luke and Huxy were very active last round and so was Prophet the round before. I would not venture a guess as to why the others are not playing, and I am not sure why you would blame the ones that are not playing on me. But the round is young so maybe the others will play when they get time. I am pretty sure I saw Huxy make a base, but not pos. Either way since the player base is so low maybe if we could find out why they no longer play we would have the answer to why so many others dont. Or maybe they are just busy....

[Peonboss]

When asked to join GEPolice, I (nor anyone else involved) was allowed to have a player account due to the amount of in-game access we had to track and find cheats. That is the level of access that you enjoyed on the Alpha server, that is the reason that you were asked to stop playing.

That only recently changed when it came to light on these very forums that the people who worked here weren't allowed to play. Overwhelmingly, the community came forward and supported the notion of trusting the people that worked here to also play here.

Let me put out there that I (and I'm quite certain that I speak for any and all playing staff) have far better things to do with my life than cheat on an online game. Especially one that I have been involved with for more than 6 and a half years. I resent that you question my "convictions".

2 things, 1 had no access like the gewar police do here, in fact I had the same access as a mod on alpha. no more or less.
And more importantly I was not questioning your convictions. I was questioning people who are sure that it is a bad idea or a good idea when most have little knowledge of what access admins have. I am sorry you read it that way but that is neither what I said nor meant.

[Luke]

RM: it is true that as long as I dont have a policy(to which you guys have to agree) that PMs can be read, they remain private by law. And those privacy rules are strict in Holland.

And I wont put up such a policy as I want them to remain private. There should always ve atleast 1 spot around here that players can trust is completely private.

As thomas said: same counts for making PMs public...illegal by law

[cookchh]

The point being, I've lost my trust in the alliance page, as a means to discuss tactics and plans. I really don't want to go to a seperate forum, I think it degrades the game and interupts flow. Gewar should be the whole package. Reason why I'm not enthused about xfire. BUT DON'T GO THERE!

[HellCarrot]

yes Luke and Huxy can be bothered and have so much spare time to be going in and reading daily all the alliances boards for plans so they can go around and pm all there mod mates, so they can win the battle lmao

[Peonboss]

Hate to be the one to poke a hole in your theory cook.. But to quote from the sticky at top of the alliance notes (in part some not safe for here)...

Welcome to my toy land.
Goals: Have fun. Talk a lot. Make opening the alliance page fun to do, a lot. Get cities, lose cities. If we have fun here the cities won't matter. Help the newbies.
Stratergy: If I cant spell it we dont need it.
Colors: ....... Not mandatory I will just mention your name in the looser list in the alliance notes daily till you do.
Brains: Not really needed but helpful.


We really have no plan except to have fun, so safe or not there really are no high level talks going on. I mean you can start some I guess, but really no alot of point.

[Starbuck]

The point being, I've lost my trust in the alliance page, as a means to discuss tactics and plans. I really don't want to go to a seperate forum, I think it degrades the game and interupts flow. Gewar should be the whole package. Reason why I'm not enthused about xfire. BUT DON'T GO THERE!

Well cook if you post tactics etc on the alliance page then even a member of your alliance can give that info away if you have a spy in your team... That's why (usually when alliances have been together for a while) they have a forum or xfire to chat about stuff they don't want the alliance to see, specially when you invite new players in to be sure they aren't spies...

The admins however don't sit all day long reading alliance pages and Luke just confirmed that he is the only one that can see it so you don't have to worry about it :)

[cookchh]

I really don't care if luke does, he's a third party to the game.

[HellCarrot]

must be Huxy out to read all alliance boards to help his fellow mods then lmao
I can see it now, him refreshing a few times a day to see what alliances plans are lmao
you make me lol honestly, think i am going to fall off the couch in tears of loling


p.s GB no random f's :D

[Starbuck]

I really don't care if luke does, he's a third party to the game.

Then you don't have to worry about the admins because he is the only one that can read your alliance page :)

[pitoh]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=JYj5fIckoFM#!

I'm italian and in real life my government had for 20 years a real conflict of interests and it was our President.....I'm not saying it's fine....I'm saying that a lot of people that is playing now fighted with staff members in the past and it was absolutly fine, but Jeff........he was massive jeweller and impossible to beat....

oh and let me say cookchh that I'm playing this game from 2006 and only 1 time LUKE post something in my alliance board and was just for calm down a nasty situation.....

So my opinion is if you play a game created/managed by someone how you cannot trust him/them?

PS:

bilibembem bilibembem bilibembem

bilibibilibibembem bilibembem bilibembem

bilibibilibibembem bilibembem bilibembem

bilibibilibibembem bilibembem bilibembem

[Spywareagen7]

I'm saying that a lot of people that is playing now fighted with staff members in the past and it was absolutly fine, but Jeff........he was massive jeweller and impossible to beat....

Jeff was never impossible to beat, only difficult, he took consistent attention from the members of GoH the reset that he unfortunately wound up leaving the game I believe, but he has and will be bested again if his official return does happen... perhaps attacking St. Louis could spark some jeweling for the old bloke hehe


PS:

bilibembem bilibembem bilibembem

bilibibilibibembem bilibembem bilibembem

bilibibilibibembem bilibembem bilibembem

bilibibilibibembem bilibembem bilibembem

my god friend, you've found it, the secret formula, we've been looking so long, time to mass produce and use it to sedate our enemies, gewar shall be minee!!!!!

[pitoh]

my god friend, you've found it, the secret formula, we've been looking so long, time to mass produce and use it to sedate our enemies, gewar shall be minee!!!!!

Sicilian Style.......

As for Jeff....mmmmmm....I was with him that round....;)

[Luke]

What? This is about my ability to read the alliance pages if I want? Like I don't have better things to do.

Even more: I don't want to know what is said on your alliance page. In the past sometimes people forwarded stuff where players were saying things about me. And it can hurt to read that. While the player saying it most of the time didn't mean it but was just venting frustration. So I do not wish to know.

But I do want to be honest that I can read it ofcourse. It's in the database. And should players notify me that there is a real problem(hacking/cheating for example) I might have to check the messages to make sure what is forwarded to me wasn't 'reworded' for example.

For the rest I don't care, and I'm the only one who can read them. If you wish to use the alliance page or not is ofcourse up to you. It's just thrown in there because players asked for them as it's easier to coordinate battles. As much as I don't care what is written there, I also couldn't care less if you choose to use it or not.

[Luke]

I really don't care if luke does, he's a third party to the game.

And there I always thought I was the owner of gewar? :confused:

[cookchh]

And there I always thought I was the owner of gewar? :confused:

Sorry I meant third party to war aspect of the game. I know you have no vested interest in alien invasion or peter principal for that matter. Which is how the game has to be run. Question had been posed if an admin had been reading our page, after a member was scolded for something they had said on it.

[Capt_ItchyBeard]

And there I always thought I was the owner of gewar? :confused:


Sorry luke but I am Batman I own it all see all and read all

http://www.gewar.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=178&pictureid=1528

[RagingMongoose]

Should i feel bad that you didnt mention me RM :'(

Take it as a compliment. You just didn't strike me as ranting about a particular issue or topic so I let you off the hook haha.

RM: it is true that as long as I dont have a policy(to which you guys have to agree) that PMs can be read, they remain private by law. And those privacy rules are strict in Holland.

And I wont put up such a policy as I want them to remain private. There should always ve atleast 1 spot around here that players can trust is completely private.

And that is your choice, one that I wouldn't try to convince on because I know how strongly you feel on the topic. All I'll say is that by not having a messaging policy that allows for PMs to be checked, thereby essentially providing a "guarenteed" private arena for communication as part of your game, it could pose a small risk to you as owner in certain circumstances. There is, afterall, a very good reason why I'm not aware of a single business or online email provider/host that don't have a messaging policy - and that reason is to cover their own backsides.

[Luke]

I auto accept the Dutch laws. These laws do state that if the police ask for it, I have to give them my whole PM database for example.

[aravan]

Quite honestly I think ALL members of GEWar should play actively, and that includes Luke. What motivation would there be for an admin or the owner of the game to actually cheat? And even if they did what would it really get them?

"The people" always complain that those in positions of power dont understand what the masses do or how they do it on a daily basis. Not that this game is on any type of grand scale but the theory still applies.

Luke. I think you should start playing along with all the rest of the staff in as active a manner as you can. It is good to see how things are working these days from a player perspective. You own the game because you loved to play it. So play it. Same with the others who are on staff. My opinion...

[Luke]

Oh I would want to play Aravan. But currently have almost zero time left. When in over a week I finally have more time, I need to catch up with a lot of work around here first.

[aravan]

Oh I would want to play Aravan. But currently have almost zero time left. When in over a week I finally have more time, I need to catch up with a lot of work around here first.

LOL! I understand completely. I said "in as active as a manner as you can". Maybe the start of next round would be a good time. Just something for some thought...

[jokosr]

Luke. I think you should start playing along with all the rest of the staff in as active a manner as you can.

Yes bring back Lukepuuk !!!!!! ;smoking

[ronnielim]

luke got multiple accounts?? BANNED HIM~~!!!

Yes bring back Lukepuuk !!!!!! ;smoking

[jokosr]

luke got multiple accounts?? BANNED HIM~~!!!

lukes player name before he bought gewar from Micky was lukepuuk he has not used it since...

[RagingMongoose]

luke got multiple accounts?? BANNED HIM~~!!!

If only all players with multiple accounts got banned rather than some quietly slipping into the night, eh?

[Specter]

Hahahaha look at little Chris giving it big time!
Why didn't you ask on the help desk or pm one of the admins directly rather then bring it to the forum?Everyone can see that deep down, you both are questioning whether admins can or are cheating?
Oh, are you implying I should go kill myself? What a wanderful thing to say dude.. where did you learn that one, on the school playing field?

Them playing or not is my business as one of the admins is a good friend who is in my alliance... And I'm saying if its because you being a little turd that they can't play anymore then I'll make slight adjustments to what I have planned :)

Dude, shutup.. you're being ridiculous.

[RagingMongoose]

Dude, shutup.. you're being ridiculous.

He already moved on, was there really a need to respond with that about 20 hours after the argument took place?

[Specter]

He already moved on, was there really a need to respond with that about 20 hours after the argument took place?

Yes, I wasn't on for 20 hours and needed to throw my opinion in there. ;icoffee

[ronnielim]

i have 10... ask the police...

If only all players with multiple accounts got banned rather than some quietly slipping into the night, eh?

[RagingMongoose]

i have 10... ask the police...

Have or had?

[ronnielim]

should be still active.... u got to ask the police, I am not the one keeping track

Have or had?

[Decooter]

I am one of these alternate accounts. ;genny

[kaltho]

I don't know What. Who's on first though.

[LuckyLuciano]

I don't know What. Who's on first though.
Are you sure? Who is on second

[Peonboss]

Who is playing third.

[LuckyLuciano]

who is on first

[Peonboss]

What's the guys name on first?

[LuckyLuciano]

WHO IS ON FIRST

[yome]

Time to close?

[cookchh]

Who is going to close?

[Spywareagen7]

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-V5ftwaD_nHk/Tz6E984C9uI/AAAAAAAAB54/x66axQ60mxs/s1600/abbott_costello.jpg

[LuckyLuciano]

he cant do that cook
who is on first

[Chris16]

Who is on first?

[laevus]

I don't know's on third. Who's on first. Everybody knows that...

[cookchh]

That’s who?

[laevus]

No. Who's who, he's on first, and that's that.

[LuckyLuciano]

No, he’s on third. We’re not talking about him. Now let’s get back to first.

[Chris16]

So who's on first?

[Luke]

Is the question on this topic now clear? Because in that case I'd like to close it as it's completely offtopic.

[evian]

what is who?

[kaltho]

Is the question on this topic now clear? Because in that case I'd like to close it as it's completely offtopic.

I may have did that accidently ;)