The best reason to quit GEWar

[Decooter]

The following is a quote from an alliance mate:

"I wonder why I play this game anymore. The objective I thought when I started was to own cities. It seems like about 90% of the alliances out there just think it's to create busy work for the people they attack without having any objective in mind. I like to have to think while I play a game and this game has become very very little thinking. I used to have to think when I played this game, now it's just mindless running around. If things don't change in the way the game is set up so there is an objective to chase this will probably be my last time I donate and (my) last reset. Get rid of hit and runs all together. people don't go to war just because and it is a war game. There is suppose to be an objective to war...money, land, resources, slavery, something. The game has become a joke to me and looks like it will soon be time to move on unless Luke makes a decent reason to stay."

The problem is, this person is not the only one that feels this way. He/she said in the quote that we need to "get rid of hit and runs" and while I disagree because I do think they have their place, the new additions to the game since we switched servers and merged .co.uk with .net have made it so hit and runs are MORE EFFECTIVE than holding cities:

Cities are worth less than they used to be. You can make more geos by not having cities at all and saving resources, than when you are spending money trying to defend cities.

You can't defend cities worth a damn because the nuke shields are worthless now

Because players can't risk defending cities with bigger armies, hit and runs are now THE official way to fight your enemy.

I could go on (because there ARE a lot more reasons) but I think it's about time to get to the point:

The best reason to quit GEWar?

Holding cities is neither worth it, nor fun anymore.

[Carach]

its an age old debate decooter. the game's been like this forever, latest changes have merely made h&rs more prominent.

some like it, others find it repetitive and boring...personally; i only stick around because of the community i've played with for years.

[Decooter]

It wasn't NEARLY as bad in 2008 when I joined .net. It's like each time they make changes it further penalizes people who want to hold cities.

Where's the industry? That made holding and defending cities rewarding, and gave goals for everyone to try to reach, whether you were in a big alliance or playing solo.

Where's the security from nuke shields? Again, you can't defend worth a damn if you know the second they see your big army they will nuke it and there's nothing you can do.

Where's the income for holding cities? Cities used to give 100 geos no matter how small, so it made sense and was fun to try to get as many as possible, and it actually paid enough that you could spare troops to defend them.

The way this game was before, it was actually about holding cities and trying to take over territories, and eventually the world.

Please tell me, why should any player hold cities at all? They have to spend geos defending them, only to have them hit and run repeatedly, and then when they get fed up with hit and runs and try to defend with more troops, the city gets nuked and they loose it all.

GEWar has become a game about holding cities, except holding cities isn't even important anymore. The population (of active players) has been declining steadily ever since I got into GEWar, and so has the incentive to hold and keep cities. Coincidence? Not at all.

[RagingMongoose]

Just to pick up on a couple of points here:

Firstly, I don't agree that holding cities isn't important at all anymore. Ultimately, cities and their value are used to determine how successful an alliance has been. During the round, hit and runs may cause players to become demotivated and cities may not be held by choice. However, other than Misfits maybe, almost all other alliances determine their success by position on the Alliance Leaderboard, or by their position on there compared to their enemy. Until score is properly reintroduced then that will always have to be the case.

Secondly, although I don't necessarily agree with the basis or reasons behind his comments, I agree with LemonWarlord (this round) and the others in the past who have said that the current nuke price vs nuke shield being vulnerable needs some reworking.

Finally, I don't agree on the income from cities point. Prior to us changing to this version, cities made less geos, not more. Cities are worth more now than they ever were in the old version, however I would agree that they should be worth more still potentially.

Overall I think if a player is going to quit, they're going to quit. Hit and runs and nuke shields are two of the many reasons that a player could name, however I think if you still enjoy the game overall these smaller points can be easily overlooked.

[Starbuck]

Make nuke shields like in old version so that it can't be destroyed, then you can actually defend your cities and make hit and runs a bit more difficult. It's ridiculous how a hit and runners army can just go on for hours because you can't defend your cities properly.


Interception and splitting will also be a great help with this.

[kaltho]

Personally I think they should divide the globe up into different areas like risk and give you bonuses or rewards for owning certain parts of the globe. That way the smaller alliances have an objective other then to just be a pitiful nusience.

You forgot this part in that quote from earlier.

This game just needs an objective for it to be a game. Right now all I feel like I'm doing is logging on to see how the friends I've made are doing. I can do that on facebook also, but I come back because this is where I met them.

If you ever want this to be a game, we need to treat it like a game, not just a cluster !@#$ of things to do.

Rangingmongoose says "Overall I think if a player is going to quit, they're going to quit." Ragingmongoose that's the whole point why I brought this up. I don't want to quit, but right now I see very little stategy in this game. That was the whole reason I first came to the game "stategy".

There is no clear objective, I thought it was to gain city value when I came, but the system is set too far agains tsmaller alliance that the only thing the feel like they can do is hit and run because that's what used to be done to bleed an alliance years ago. Without the ability to have other alliance pick up those cities you hit and ran...it's almost useless . We can't buy the cities back anymore so they just get attacked by the previous owner, everyone knows this so they no longer try to get to those cities to have them bought back (which was a wierd way to play the game I always thought, but some people liked it).

We need to think of a way to make the smaller alliance feel like they have something to do. I thought that splitting the globe into regions and give bonus for holding regions might help, but I'm sure there is other things that would also.

I also read alot of comments about nuke shields, and since the switch I find the whole nuke / nuke shield broken. It's just out of balance.

[Prophet]

Back in 2008 you had people quitting for the opposite reason, because some groups were holding cities for 40+ days and bullying people off the map and hit & run was a futile enterprise.

I recently quit. I think it was all the pointless negativity in the forums and the fact that my real life got busy. I honestly believe that people just outgrow the game as time goes by, and try to justify it however they have to...just like every other game in this world.

[RagingMongoose]

Kaltho, all I'll say is that if you're considering quitting due to hit and runs, you're allowing them to have the effect that you're enemy is aiming for. It is a demoralising strategy to fight against, but for the very reason that you're considering quitting because of it, it is a valid strategy.

BoB have 19 members, 3rd have 33. It is a natural strategy that they are trying to demotivate your members towards inactivity or quitting.

I'm not saying I agree with the above strategy, but that's just how things are. Basically, if you quit, the hit and runners win.

I would also add that North America is particularly bad for this. Having played the last 3 rounds there, more newbies place their HBs there than anywhere else traditionally so you get more one off attacks too.

My personal opinion is that there is more strategy than ever involved in GEWar. However, obviously I can only comment from my own battles and wars.

[Decooter]

Ive decided due to the current state of the game and that fact that over the 2 years I have played this game it has only gotten worse as time passes, that I will not be returning next round. I don't see the game getting better, I only see changes added each time that hurt the fun, and the fact that the game is slowly bleeding active players only makes it worse. I do not see this game lasting much longer because of all of this.

I will be joining AvP for the remainder of the round, because a lot of the people there are great players and are some of my oldest GEWar friends, plus I have some geos to blow on WTO :vinsent and then I will not be returning the next reset (I may plant a base and log on very rarely just because).

[kaltho]

Raginmongoose, I just posted this on my alliance page. It has nothing to do with hit and runs, it has to do with purpose. The only reason there is a point to hit and huns at this time is because there is no other point. I do understand what hit and runs used to be good for, they've lost alot of their purpose with the new monetary changes to the game, but they still do have a little value "if used right". Yes, I do dislike hit and runs, but would never quit over something so trivial. I dislike them because it's mindless busywork. If i could hire a monkey to do what I do after a hit and run, I wouldn't mind them as much. I just hate playing a game with a monkey mentality when I started playing because the game made me think.



Kaltho says
"you know when I started, I was crushed by red drawf my first few months....but it was fun. Then in vulture we were crushed bt WTO but I had fun. Then the next vulture we tried to fight WTO again but got crushed by TLI I think, but it was fun. Then I joined BNW, we had all fun wars. Then 3rd world, also all fun wars until this last 2 resets. With the changes it just seems like they took all the stadegy out of the game and it's built for more mindless play then it used to be. One huge thing that does does stand out though is the ability not to be able to defend your cities anymore, the army intercepting thing was super cool, but vanished. Bonus for city value in interest great idea...vanished...zeroing people to get rid of bonds, great idea....vanished. What is the point to hold a city, what is the point to zero a player....I just see nothing. Some of the reasons for smaller alliances to try and hold cities are gone. So what becomes their objective? They can't do alot against a large alliance like WTO or us, everytime they try and hold a city they lose it quickly. Perhaps we need to make it much more expensive to travel? Use more oil? that way a small alliance can defend a certain area much more effectively if Luke game them a reason to hold a smaller area."

[Starbuck]

I just hate playing a game with a monkey mentality when I started playing because the game made me think.

This is probably the best sentence I have read since the start of the round. Very very true, the game (for me) just seems to be going downhill when, after playing for 3 years, should be going forward. It's supposed to become more fun but all I want now is to play this game, but the game it used to be when I started to play.

Don't get me wrong I love the game and I love the people but atm there is something wrong here and I think everyone is starting to notice it more and more

[LemonWarlord]

I agree with this thread.

One thing I would like to say though.

If you implement score with respect to value (your value creates score), then you lose a lot of incentive to hit and run, or even just fight a losing war without sufficient strength. And there would be a reason to admit defeat rather than fight a war of attrition.

Because cities have no long term value. They cost more to defend than they earn, and they're so temporary, that it's pointless.

[Decooter]

I agree with this thread.

One thing I would like to say though.

If you implement score with respect to value (your value creates score), then you lose a lot of incentive to hit and run, or even just fight a losing war without sufficient strength. And there would be a reason to admit defeat rather than fight a war of attrition.

Because cities have no long term value. They cost more to defend than they earn, and they're so temporary, that it's pointless.

Thank you. Also, non-damageable nuke shields.

[RagingMongoose]

Raginmongoose, I just posted this on my alliance page. It has nothing to do with hit and runs, it has to do with purpose. The only reason there is a point to hit and huns at this time is because there is no other point. I do understand what hit and runs used to be good for, they've lost alot of their purpose with the new monetary changes to the game, but they still do have a little value "if used right". Yes, I do dislike hit and runs, but would never quit over something so trivial. I dislike them because it's mindless busywork. If i could hire a monkey to do what I do after a hit and run, I wouldn't mind them as much. I just hate playing a game with a monkey mentality when I started playing because the game made me think.


Yep, it's a pain to pick up hit and run cities, can't argue with that.

I can only speak from my own experiences in the game, however AvP are half the size of WTO and we've achieved a lot. More importantly though, we've had to employ more strategy this round than we've had to in any round I've been with the Alien guys previously just to achieve what we have. The game is what you make of it ultimately. 3rd wanted a quieter round from what I understood so moved to SA to get away from WTO. Now you're having a quieter round but in turn that means there is less strategy and you're fighting smaller alliances than yourselves.

The point/objective of the game is simple - beat your enemy on the alliance value leaderboard. 3rd have been at the top all round with very little resistance, certainly not active and/or equal resistance. More to the point though, to say that smaller alliances can't hope to beat larger ones is disproved by your very own threat to quit here. The more that quit, the more that go inactive, the more equal the terms that the smaller alliance is fighting on.

AvP on the other hand have had a very difficult round, with much resistance and a lot of battles. We have been outnumbered by more than 2 to 1 for most of the round. However, I've enjoyed this round more than any other I've played so far. The strategic planning, the coordinated attacks, and the way a bad situation has really cemented a great group of people together in the game has been really fun.

I guess you get out of the game what you put in. Ok I'll admit more features need to be added, army interception that you mentioned is a massive one. However, they're being worked on and Prophet shared a list of all the features and fixes they were working on on another thread. Alien Invasion/Alien Mafia/AvP have fought difficult wars every round, mostly outnumbered, and each time requiring a lot of strategy. I think that's why most of the core alliance players still enjoy the game so much - it's a challenge every round. Win or lose, we have fun along the way, and since I've been playing we have tended to win because we have fun.

It's up to you Kaltho, no one wants to see a player quit, but if you feel you have to then there doesn't appear to be anything I or anyone else can say to change your mind.

[Peonboss]

There is score remember. But not till end. And it has little to do with cities.
It is not worth owning cities right now, you loose geos.

I agree the balance isn't right. We planned and set the balance on no bank access with out city value. Once that was removed it made h r the name of the game. I doubt anyone has made as much cash as I did off the two market fluctuations but it is of no use.
The only way I see to bring balance back is to make value a part of banking. No value no interest and no access. Fix market so selling is anon and the game would be 109% more interesting. Just 2 small fixes.

[Prophet]

The game as it was built was correct in the no bank without value. Once that went away (at the request of the players) the reason to hold cities was gone. Same goes with the bank transfers and the fact that larger groups could bully people off the map. We remove it based on complaints and now other people complain.

I really think that the current coders have an uphill battle in trying to strike a balance that will make people happy. We tried to do that since 2008, and no matter what we did it seemed to always be some form of complaining. Back then it was the GEPolitics and sitting on cities forever. So we changed that. Now it's the other side complaining. if they reintroduce classic features in this code set we will just spark another form of complaining.

I honestly think some people are too proud to admit that they have outgrown this game. It's always been a simple game with a rinse-repeat mentality (since 2005)...you just now are starting to notice it.

[Decooter]

I think the problem is that while it is true that some people complained when holding cities was the standard, I'd be willing to bet the majority of players would rather hold cities than Hit and run. So it's in the best interest of the game to adjust the game to the majority rather than the minority. I think the problem was that the people complaining before were fewer in number, but louder than the rest. Now that they got the change, I think we will find that more people liked it better the other way.

Now I may be proven wrong, but it seems to me that what I have said is true. There is a minority that like it the way it is now, while there seemed to be more happy people before all the changes.

[RagingMongoose]

I think there are two features that need to be reintroduced, that as Peon's threads last round showed, are the most requested features:

1) Score - Similar to how it was, but maybe incorporating value somehow.

2) Army interception

Add these two features and I think most would be happy from what I've seen.

[Decooter]

I think there are two features that need to be reintroduced, that as Peon's threads last round showed, are the most requested features:

1) Score - Similar to how it was, but maybe incorporating value somehow.

2) Army interception

Add these two features and I think most would be happy from what I've seen.

I hate to sound like a broken record but.... indestructible nuke shields. I think that's more important than interception.

[Peonboss]

I don't think I have ever requested either. Sorry but not my dream fix.

[RagingMongoose]

I don't think I have ever requested either. Sorry but not my dream fix.

I didn't say you had. However, the threads you started last round where players could vote on the features they wanted ranked score and army interception very high.

[Prophet]

...and I don't think either is a high priority. Score will be completely different and will be coming back...just not anytime soon (maybe in 2011), and army interception was stupid, but I think the coders are looking at it.

[RagingMongoose]

army interception was stupid

Why was it stupid? Just asking, not having a go.

[outofnowhere]

Why was it stupid? Just asking, not having a go.

Army intercept was great fun for Donators...Near zero chance for newbies to get started. It was donators who have the option.

[RagingMongoose]

Army intercept was great fun for Donators...Near zero chance for newbies to get started. It was donators who have the option.

Yeah, I grant you that was a little unfair in some respects, but aside from that then it was a great feature for fun like you say.

[Peonboss]

It was great for players like you who only play intermittently. Removed most strategy and skill. In my opinion at least.

[Prophet]

I just never liked the feature. Thought it was a waste of time to code, and a stupid addition to the game. It wasn't as bad as indestructible nuke shields, but close in the stupid department.

[Luke]

I remember the army interception. Took me ages to complete...was a feature suggested by players...and brought me more trouble than perhaps any other feature(well except for DOND). I had more complaints about that one. Also ofcourse because it was a donatorfeature and new players complained there was no chance for them. If it comes back, then probably for all players and not just donators. I hate my PM box and email filling up with complaints all the time.

As for the thread...I'm kinda confused again: when player wants city taxes to be worth more(something I simply forgot to upgrade) then they should just tell me. Because when I read a thread saying you want to quit my basic reaction is always: if you are not having fun, just quit. I never see the reason for a thread about that. Never did and never will. Also makes no impact on me.

After some time a game always becames a bore. I've played several games online and when I was fed up with it, I just stopped playing. Never felt the urge to go to the support forum and to post I was quitting.

In my world it's simple: want things to change(especially when I forget) that need my attention right away, then let me know. Need to quit, then quit. That is meant with all respect. It's just the way it usually goes on most online games right? One day, a player doesn't return. Probably the way it's supposed to go. I mean....longest I've played an online game was probably 6 months. So I'm already amazed how long people stick around. And ofcourse I love that. But I can't expect people to keep hanging around for years.

And one thing though: I do agree with the goal. Have been breaking my head about that one for years. The original goal was world domination. But it's impossible, and would just end up in all players leaving.

End of gewar? Not by a long shot. We've had our 'dip' some time ago, and just recently got more attention from players again. So it was actually looking up. After we shut down bank transfers we noticed less activity as a lot of 'farming accounts' stopped. But those were never playing at all. And then when a round goes for several months, you always lose players. And hard for newbies to enter the game. That's because the game is still unbalanced. It's hard to balance out a game. That's why there are so many changes recently in gameplay.

I'm positive we'll find the right balance. All we need is good(read brilliant) ideas, and I guess a few coders to help out wouldn't hurt either.

But you have to understand I do everything with caution these days. Because every feature we even look into that is submitted, gets me a huge inbox of complaints from opponents to the idea and some even get personal. Was what made me take a break in the first place. Somehow people tend to take this game very serious.

My guess is that it would help if people wouldn't get frustrated when being zero'd. That would mean that either that is not possible, or getting geos would be easy. It's the number 1 frustration and the nr1 reason for people to quit.

[RagingMongoose]

It was great for players like you who only play intermittently. Removed most strategy and skill. In my opinion at least.

Yes, that's right Peon :nope. Congratulations for sounding reeeeeaaaallly intelligent and hypocritical once again! If it's a good feature for those who play intermittently, surely it's the perfect feature for you given your appalling excuse for why you're zeroed!

I just never liked the feature. Thought it was a waste of time to code, and a stupid addition to the game. It wasn't as bad as indestructible nuke shields, but close in the stupid department.

I can imagine it's a nightmare to code, definitely can't argue with that. However, it was good fun and this is a game.....afterall having fun is most of the reason people play.

[Peonboss]

Hahaha so much fun to read ragin being ragin after lukes sensible post.

[Luke]

I can imagine it's a nightmare to code, definitely can't argue with that. However, it was good fun and this is a game.....afterall having fun is most of the reason people play.

I think that was the reason I took a big break from gewar. Our passion is for others to have fun, but a lot of comments and posts on new features were usually negative. Sometimes instulting and some even absurd. Yet those posters kept playing so must be a reason. But I sometimes thought it wasn't fun at all.

But a feature submitted by one, gets backed by a lot...except those against it. Those only usually speak out after it's a real feature inside the game(when it's too late). So coding can be fun, but frustrating also. I think for a lot of coders the forum is the downside of the game. However it's also the community which makes it the positive side for the gamers.

[RagingMongoose]

Hahaha so much fun to read ragin being ragin after lukes sensible post.

http://www.sthbodyjewelry.com/catalog/images/080106-0115.jpg

I think that was the reason I took a big break from gewar. Our passion is for others to have fun, but a lot of comments and posts on new features were usually negative. Sometimes instulting and some even absurd. Yet those posters kept playing so must be a reason. But I sometimes thought it wasn't fun at all.

But a feature submitted by one, gets backed by a lot...except those against it. Those only usually speak out after it's a real feature inside the game(when it's too late). So coding can be fun, but frustrating also. I think for a lot of coders the forum is the downside of the game. However it's also the community which makes it the positive side for the gamers.

Many players are passionate about this game, which can lead to comments being negative at times. I think the important thing for coders to remember is that 99% of the players here love the game and if posts seem negative, it's just because they care what happens. We players don't always convey our thoughts about the game that well, but the fact that players stay around despite being negative about game features shows more about the true feeling towards the game in my opinion, rather than the comments themselves.

I hope now Prophet has retired, the one thing that continues is the open communication with players about the direction of the game. Prophet really improved this last round and it would be a shame if it disappeared again.

Finally I'd say this. From looking through the threads about features, sure there are some negative posts, but they are far outweighed by the constructive/postive posts. It's important not to let the highly vocal and loud minority overshadow the quieter but more frequent majority.

[accipitus]

sure, some features gone away...such as defend wall...

[HellCarrot]

seriously another thread of quitting gewar and hit and runs are killing the game. how many is that now we have had.
so some hit and run big deal, stop crying and defend ur cities or get them back, what do you want to do sit in ur cities all game doing nothing. most that do hit and runs plan to keep the cities, besides some like myself that dont care about them. Hit and run only players are rare. Most people are working in some way to get value so they can get up in the score for value. It being used a lot now due to a few wars going on. YOU KNOW THAT WAR THING YOU DO IN THIS GAME!!
yes i miss some features but like all changes you have to think about how to work around them. Luke is never gonna make everyone happy in the game and will continue to change things around. So all the ones that say they cant think in this game no more. well think of ways to work around what your not happy with

not many owners of a game get on to talk to the players and care what they think, so how about telling him things that u want and suggestions. He can only say yes or no or cant because of

[foxhound]

i kind of got bored and a bit disappointed when game elements were removed due to 'cheaters' . You don't take away guns in 'call of duty' because people cheat , right?

same thing applies to the removal of bank transfers.

that almost killed it for me. I'm still here though , just not as much due to RL.

[LemonWarlord]

seriously another thread of quitting gewar and hit and runs are killing the game. how many is that now we have had.
so some hit and run big deal, stop crying and defend ur cities or get them back, what do you want to do sit in ur cities all game doing nothing. most that do hit and runs plan to keep the cities, besides some like myself that dont care about them. Hit and run only players are rare. Most people are working in some way to get value so they can get up in the score for value. It being used a lot now due to a few wars going on. YOU KNOW THAT WAR THING YOU DO IN THIS GAME!!
yes i miss some features but like all changes you have to think about how to work around them. Luke is never gonna make everyone happy in the game and will continue to change things around. So all the ones that say they cant think in this game no more. well think of ways to work around what your not happy with

not many owners of a game get on to talk to the players and care what they think, so how about telling him things that u want and suggestions. He can only say yes or no or cant because ofYou obviously think everything is fine because you don't look at the other aspect of the game. Ignoring it doesn't solve the problem.

Also, I like this point "people don't go to war just because and it is a war game. There is suppose to be an objective to war...money, land, resources, slavery, something." Right now, there is no long term benefit to holding cities.

[Starbuck]

But a feature submitted by one, gets backed by a lot...except those against it. Those only usually speak out after it's a real feature inside the game(when it's too late). So coding can be fun, but frustrating also. I think for a lot of coders the forum is the downside of the game. However it's also the community which makes it the positive side for the gamers.

Is the complaining really that bad? I was looking at some old threads and can't really see much complaints. I think sometimes players post negatively but it's also to give their opinion and it just sounds a lot worse then it is.

Like this thread, it's not negative if you read the posts (I know some posts are)... Yes the word quit is in the title but it's mostly just another thread of posts with ideas of how to make the game better for everyone.

[Decooter]

@ Luke: "If you don't like it, quit" is a HORRIBLE response for a game developer to say, if you care at all about retaining player. I mean, I could understand if I was some new player who joined a week ago and said "this game is no fun I lost all my geos and cant hold a city this game sucks". Then you could be like "if you dont like it, don't play" however I'm a long term player of over 2 years and I used to like the game, and now the fun is gone. You should not be telling me to just quit.

I could have PM'd you about the things I don't like, but I did not because I felt like you would think I was just complaining directly to you and would ignore me.

@ Hellcarrot: you say "so some hit and run big deal, stop crying and defend ur cities or get them back". I would do that IF ONLY it were actually possible. But if you try to defend against them you need a lot bigger armies, and then they get NUKED. This used to be fixed by the indestructible nuke shields, but somehow the developers think it was the worst idea to ever come out of the human race (how can you think that?). I guess they like the nuke shields to be as worthless as holding a city (see: completely and utterly useless)

The sad thing is, normally it is hard to balance a game like this, however it is not the case this time because some of the features that could help balance the game WERE ALREADY IMPLEMENTED BEFORE and they could just be put back in.

[HellCarrot]

LemonWarlord i wont bother with your carry on of nothing as per normal

but decooter you got to understand that, when the sheilds were unable to be nuked, people complained that the rich held the cities and the poor didnt. Big alliance had it all and small couldnt hold.
As i dont hold cities except one round in a while i get to sit back and see it all. Last game misfits fought WTO and they attacked us all game and we them and yet we still managed to hold cities and come 3rd in value. So it can be done it a matter of working out what is the best way to try and do that. I do agree to a point on the nuke shields that something needs to be found that is in the middle of what it was and what is now. avp and wto are proof that even in war and with nuke shields as they are you can hold cities and they been waring all game.
So instead of having this thread, with i will quit that only make luke turn off, why not start one saying.
i want to get a list of things we want and then see if luke will answer yes or no or why he cant next to it all.
I am sure there is reasons beyond cheaters that has the game missing some of the things we liked before.

[King_Diamond]

I don't really get the point of Hit and runs being part of a war game, sorry. Simply doesn't make sense at all, but that just my 2 cents.
As for the destructible nuke shields, I made a thread for it: http://www.gewar.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13979
The prices sure would need to be adjusted, but this would be an easy thing to code (at least I think so :) )

And for the "when you don't like it, just quit" thing:
That's easy to say of course, but there is alway a reason why people do quit. I understand this game is still in beta. So there are changes made to make the game better. but sometimes it goes into the wrong direction until the right balance is found. So it is really important to listen to the players instead of telling them to leave. It's the players that keep the game alive in the end.

[Starbuck]

I don't mind hit and runs but the game is in a position atm where you can't defend your cities so it's easier to hit and run more cities. If nuke shields can't be destroyed then at least you can defend your cities to prevent hit and runners a little more...

[HellCarrot]

Now that is how you post when you want something changed, u dont say your quitting or hate the game. You dont trash the people or the game, you simply give an idea of what or something that might be done.
by the way great idea too king dimaond. very easy and meets halfway for boths sides

No offense taken on ur thoughts on hit and runs each to there own. no point having a heap of alliances that like it. ;)

[Prophet]

Is the complaining really that bad?

In short...Yes. This game is generally negative.

Either staff is abusing someone, my feature is gone, My army got killed, the ratio sucks, I lost a city, the game screwed me, I'm quiting, this game sucks, this player sucks, peon sucks, no you suck, this alliance sucks, I want to be a potty mouth, etc....it's a daily activity around here to login, see the negativity, try to give some perspective, deal with more negativity, think about coding, deal with even more negativity, get frustrated and finally log off without accomplishing anything. Even fun threads get hijacked nowadays by negative posters.

Sure some players are decent people and seem to remain positive, but I can count those people on 2 hands.

@Decooter....I'm gonna try to be delicate here. You make a public forum post with the title "Reasons to quit this game" filled with subjective issues that are affecting a very small portion of the players and then say that a developer of this game has the wrong attitude about retaining players. Who do you think he should be retaining? Players that make forum posts about reasons to quit his game?

The attitude Luke has is not only right, but it's healthy. It's foolish for a developer of a game to expect to retain the majority of the players of the game. Too many outside factors come into play. He knows that every player playing today will eventually leave. We've lost players that have contributed far more time and energy, and we will lose even more as time goes by...it comes with the territory.

I also agree about the "I quit" threads being ridiculous. If you have to leave or want to leave then just go. No one will stop you. When you make these threads it always comes down to somehow we failed you. That by making a change (or not making a change) to the game we somehow let you down and made you leave, and when you leave your going to make a scene and draw out people to discuss how we let you down...breeding discontent and getting the final say on how bad we have treated you.

We didn't let you or any other player down. If you feel that way then fine...feel that way. We develop in our spare time for your fun. If the game isn't fun anymore then let us part way without any grandstanding or narcissistic postings. I mean how many posts are there about players who have left and failed us by not fulfilling their obligations as players? Let me know when you find one.

[HRH]

Sorry wanted to say LUKE and PROPHET in the title :D

Just want to point out, that we never had so many "Donators" in the game since i joined in 2007.
The reason was "giving some privileges" to the donators and "not allowing the Geo transfers" anymore.
Some peope dont like it, but i think the result keeping the game alive with donatore counts as a first priority.
So looking at the result, it could not be wrong doing these things.
Yes there are always people who moan (like me sometimes :D) but i never would have the idea to quit.
Coders look at all the people who are still here..... If you guys would not have done an excellrent job, i think the game was already dead for years.

Nukeshields, interception, all the new things which came and go are always worth to try. If they are not perfect, thanks a lot for coding and taking your time for this, BUT you were fullfilling wishes of players and thats what counts. You made them happy. If it shows that it is not good for the game delete it ann sorry for the work, but you made a lot of people happy that they can try out how their ideas work.

I miss interception and statistics and the low advantages donators have, knowing we need noobs to try out the game, but keep in mind that Donatore are very important, you need them to keep the game running.
Just give noobs the advantages of donatore for a special time period to find out that it is worth to play the game.

So guys go on with your perfect work, let us moan (thats part of every game) and try to fulfill (majority)gamers wishes if possible and dont take anything personal. Nobody wants to harm you, we are all glad having you.

[Decooter]

@Decooter....I'm gonna try to be delicate here. You make a public forum post with the title "Reasons to quit this game" filled with subjective issues that are affecting a very small portion of the players and then say that a developer of this game has the wrong attitude about retaining players.


I'm sorry, but the issues I've described here affect every single player who plays this game. Sure, some may see some of these "issues" in a positive light (people who like to hit and run, for example) however to say these issues affect only a very small minority is trying to make me seem like an ass for complaining, and I don't appreciate it. If I was the only one affected by something I would not bring it up in the public forums.

Who do you think he should be retaining? Players that make forum posts about reasons to quit his game?

Seeing as how the problem of losing players has been around ever since I looked at these forums for the first time, I think he should be trying to retain as many players as possible.

Look, I did not bring these issues up for the first time in this thread, Ive brought them up before in the forums, and I have seen other threads in which others bring up some of the problems I have said, and to me it seemed like the features I liked would not be returning. Whether that's true or not I can't be sure of but all I can base my thoughts on are what is conveyed through the forums. So, I don't think it's unreasonable to intend to quit a game where the game is going in a direction that you've voiced you don't like and cannot foresee being fixed anytime soon.

I think making this topic was appropriate, you do not. Let's agree to disagree on that.

[Cash]

I just want to say I love gewar!!! I've only have played in two rounds so far. So I only know the current features.

On nuke shields... Like Hellcarrot said, If a nuke shield is to strong then the richer person will hold forever. A option that could change is to make nukes cheaper and not destroy the city. It would only make troop counts go down. Then you could take the city after a couple of nukes.

On bank transfers... Last round people could do this. This round you can't. We need another way to make geos. When I run out of geos I want to keep playing and the only way to keep making geos is to jewel. I don't really like to jewel but if it was for a 100 geos each I would do it. Maybe have a limit of a 100 jewels per month.

On the Stock Market... I would love to have some form of this feature. We could invest some geos. You could make alot of geos or lose everything.

On a Casino... We could spend geos on slots, craps or even have a poker night. Casino night is when people could wager geos and walk out with more geos or lose it all.

On planting resources... Could we please change this to a 24 hour period anytime of the day. I think I've posted this before. My reason is if I forget at a certain time and have to plant late at night. I have to stay up late the next night or have to lose a day of planting.

Just some ideas...:drinks

[aberlour]

Make nuke shields like in old version so that it can't be destroyed, then you can actually defend your cities and make hit and runs a bit more difficult. It's ridiculous how a hit and runners army can just go on for hours because you can't defend your cities properly.


Interception and splitting will also be a great help with this.

If you increase oil burning for large armies it would help too.

It´s not realistic to transport 1k troops with the same oil amount then a 300k army. You need further a long saving oil phase to send a hit and run army around the world. And parking of large armies at hb´s must be more expensive then normal troop expensives.

If i´m wrong you will be hired by any army logistic to do that ;).

[Starbuck]

I just want to say I love gewar!!!

me too !!!! :lgewar

If you increase oil burning for large armies it would help too.

It´s not realistic to transport 1k troops with the same oil amount then a 300k army. You need further a long saving oil phase to send a hit and run army around the world. And parking of large armies at hb´s must be more expensive then normal troop expensives.

This is a great idea aberlour, I love it :) No need to get rid of the shields that can be destroyed then. Traveling armies with different sizes should burn up more oil if you think about it logically.

Parking armies outside a home base and not inside a city should also take more oil. I just think in the end hit and runs should be more expensive, right now it's just WAY too EASY!

[ikan]

I now miss DOND the game!! :( it was damn fun to play it

[LemonWarlord]

On nuke shields... Like Hellcarrot said, If a nuke shield is to strong then the richer person will hold forever.
Until they become poor. And they don't value every city the same.

The plain logistics of city holding is that, over time, you always lose money. If you have a indestructible shield, you need at least enough troops to make it worth defending with a indestructible shield. Then when you get attacked, you add troops, etc.

I remember people complaining about how Riyadh (and other resource cities) and NYC and Tokyo, etc. were always in the same hands. Because when it came down to it, they had enough value to be wanted to be kept. The richer person can't possibly hold forever. (I believe 1 million troops has absolutely insane upkeep). The rich get poorer, the poor get richer. No city has ever been held for the entire round, so I think that's only a supposition, not the reality of the situation.

[Carach]

i like kaltho's risk idea

i like army interceptionwhen it isnt a donator only feature (as i prefer everything to be equal anyway, or as much so as possible.) - Splitting armies would also perhaps be useful in tandem.
indestructable nuke shields i dunno...i think killable nuke shields are alright but as KD said; adjustments need to be made on them to make it viable. Right now its completely unbalanced the game.

Bonds need to come back.

Cities should become a bit more worthwhile - then again, perhaps that would not be necessary with the other features employed.

--

this all being said; the staff are not active enough nor motivated enough apparently to bring features back with the new version (i understand the old/new ones are incompatible and that is why many of these features are not here in the new version?). Additionally they lack numbers (lol..same ingame and out eh). So implementing kaltho's risk style idea from design to reality is probably a massive pipe dream that will never happen.

[Peonboss]

this all being said; the staff are not active enough nor motivated enough apparently to bring features back with the new version

Wow, all I need to say is wow.

[Luke]

I share your response Peonboss. It just proves the point of Prophet(especially his latest brilliant post) and me earlier on.

I think most of us lately spent the only free time we had (for free) on this game, and we get a: not active and motivated enough apparantly.

And then some wonder why some crewmembers quit and some needed to take a break earlier this year. I never understand comments like that.

I said it earlier in this thread: I don't understand why some players stick around if they apparantly aren't enjoying themselves. That by the way isn't meant as an: if you don't like it, just leave and close the door behind you. But I mean it in the healthy manner...I never stayed on playing a game I didn't enjoy. And when I stopped I just left and didn't feel the need to out why I'm leaving in the hope to take as many with me as I can. I would leave with my dignity and hopefully my reputation intact. Who knows, I might ever want to come back.

After some time everyone gets bored. But that doesn't mean you have to vent your frustration at developers working for fun. It's not our job. We have real lifes and all that comes with it.

And to make sure we don't get too negative and all decide to take a long break again(I'm glad I'm almost gone for vacation, otherwise I would've chosen for a break for a few months again) I am going to close this thread.

If you feel variables within the game need changing, then submit it in the gewar support forum as I refuse to do it this way. I, like every round, rely on players to let me know if city tax is too low really. This thread has become disrespectable towards crewmembers.